1500 miles and it’s BROKEN. NOT A GOOD SIGN

[ZR2_Charlie]

Thursday evening after coming home from work, I had received two Alert Text messages. One said service the engine and transmission in the next 7 days. And Friday morning before work my remote start didn’t work, but it did start manually and was running extremely rough, It felt like it could just shutdown at any moment. I received another Text message Alert that morning saying Service Transmission. I seriously could not believe this, only 1500 miles and I’m having issues like this already, this is not acceptable at all. I got it in to the dealership for service Friday afternoon, still waiting to find out what the deal is. What is the major malfunction with these vehicles being built ? They are charging an Extreme Amount for these vehicles and yet you are having problems this early. It scares the Heck out of me to be spending 60-70-80THOUSAND DOLLARS for a product that might very well wind up costing much more in the near future for repairs. NOT GOOD.

 

[8ball_99]

That sucks hopefully they will get it fixed quickly. FWIW I have 8k miles on mine with NP.
I Don't think it matters what brand or model you buy, all of them can have an issue. GM has lifter issues. Supposedly it's a low percentage, but still it's a known problem. Same time though Ford and Dodge both have known stuff too. Hell the new Tundra had a bad batch of waste gates causing the cabs to be pulled on brand new trucks. Seen a youtube video yesterday were ford 7.3 Godzila engines were having Low mileage failures due to bad parts causing the entire engine to be replaced.

I agree it's a bit ridiculous for the price that any of these engines would have any common failures. Especially engines that have been around a while. Unfortunately I think all the manufacturers look at percentages vs cost. If say one in 400 fail. It's cheaper for them to leave things alone. Say they re-engineer something and reduce the failure rate. If that fix cost say 200 bucks per vehicle. Well that's 80k per 400 engines, not counting the R&D. It's way cheaper for them to just replace a motor ever 400 vehicles.

 

[Wildturkey707]

Thursday evening after coming home from work, I had received two Alert Text messages. One said service the engine and transmission in the next 7 days. And Friday morning before work my remote start didn’t work, but it did start manually and was running extremely rough, It felt like it could just shutdown at any moment. I received another Text message Alert that morning saying Service Transmission. I seriously could not believe this, only 1500 miles and I’m having issues like this already, this is not acceptable at all. I got it in to the dealership for service Friday afternoon, still waiting to find out what the deal is. What is the major malfunction with these vehicles being built ? They are charging an Extreme Amount for these vehicles and yet you are having problems this early. It scares the Heck out of me to be spending 60-70-80THOUSAND DOLLARS for a product that might very well wind up costing much more in the near future for repairs. NOT GOOD.

Ya it sucks for sure but anything you buy can have a problem. In order to tell we will need to look at the success rate years from now. This forum even is a small sample size and I bet on here most people have not had serious problems. My dad's Dodge is a 2020 and it has had non stop problems from Infotainment to transmission. It happens.

 

[scubatech]

Thursday evening after coming home from work, I had received two Alert Text messages. One said service the engine and transmission in the next 7 days. And Friday morning before work my remote start didn’t work, but it did start manually and was running extremely rough, It felt like it could just shutdown at any moment. I received another Text message Alert that morning saying Service Transmission. I seriously could not believe this, only 1500 miles and I’m having issues like this already, this is not acceptable at all. I got it in to the dealership for service Friday afternoon, still waiting to find out what the deal is. What is the major malfunction with these vehicles being built ? They are charging an Extreme Amount for these vehicles and yet you are having problems this early. It scares the Heck out of me to be spending 60-70-80THOUSAND DOLLARS for a product that might very well wind up costing much more in the near future for repairs. NOT GOOD.

Sounds like it could be a bad injector or two. I've seen some of those reports on the Forum here. I'm sure the dealer will fix it. It does suck though.

 

[Chosenone]

Bad fuel injector. No big deal.

 

[Ereed45]

GM is using known defective lifters in their 6.2 motors. It is way more than 4%. I have had 2 now and know friends that ALL have had their motors fail at low miles. YouTube Silverado class action lawsuit. Problem is, yes they will fix under warranty but all they do is replace the same defective lifters and call it a day. I know one guy that threatened to sue and they agree to replace the entire motor but because of the numerous replacements they can't get one for 10 months. So you end up making payments on a truck sitting at a dealership waiting on a motor they can't get. Shame on GM.

 

[Flynscotsman]

Since I haven’t owned a chevrolet since 2001, I joined this forum and read a bunch of threads about lifter issues so naturally I grilled my salesman before buying my 23 ZR2, he said they were the leading ZR2 dealer in Texas and haven’t had any lifter issues with any trucks, cross my fingers

 

[securityguy]

Since I haven’t owned a chevrolet since 2001, I joined this forum and read a bunch of threads about lifter issues so naturally I grilled my salesman before buying my 23 ZR2, he said they were the leading ZR2 dealer in Texas and haven’t had any lifter issues with any trucks, cross my fingers

Of course he said that...he's a salesman and wants to desperately sell you a truck

 

[Ereed45]

Lol, my dealership told me the same thing. All you have to do is You Tube it. My 2017 Silverado ate the lifters at less than 10,000 miles. My 2022 ZR2 is already starting to destroy my 6.2. I spoke to one of the old school mechanics at my local dealership who filled me in on the real story. Chevy is using these defective Chinese lifters in all their 5.3 & 6.2 motors. They are well aware that they are garbage but due to the supply chain issues they are using them anyway so they can sell these trucks. GM falsely claims that it is only 4% but any honest dealership (oxymoron right) will tell you it is more like 40%. Gm decided that just replacing 40% of the comebacks was cheaper than a recall for all of them. The problem is, all they do is replace the defective lifters with the same defective lifters if it is under warranty. What a joke. I know one guy that pushed GM to replace the entire 6.2 (lawyered up) and his ZR2 has been sitting on the dealers lot for 6 months now because there is a shortage of 6.2's because so many are failing.
Driving in L9 doesn't work either. Yes, it will keep it from deactivating but those same bad lifters will still fail eventually.
I am a lifelong Chevy guy with 2 Corvettes in the garage right now. Never had an issue with my C2's. Shame on GM. All Mary Barra cares about now is EV's.

 

[DFWZR2]

Approximately 200k Silverados are rolling around with the L87. You contend that 80k of those have or will have lifter failures?
Approximately 1.2m L87's from model years 2020-2023 are in Tahoes, Suburbans, Yukons, Sierras, and Silverados, based on publicly available sales reports. If you back the 200k that are in Silverado's out of that number, that would be 1m engines, so with 40% failure rate that would be 400k engines that have or will have lifter failures. A majority of which would still be covered under the factory powertrain warranty. Call me crazy, but I think that would be a much more expensive problem for GM, and its ownership base, if the occurrence rate is what you say. I would think NHTSA would force a recall if it was that high, no? I certainly hope I'm not tempting fate by casting doubt on that number, but I think it's hyperbole.

I've owned 3 new Silverado's with the 6.2L (L87); 2020 LT Trail Boss (38k miles), 2022 ZR2 (8.4k miles), 2022 ZR2 (1.5k miles). The first 2022 ZR2 I owned was purchased by another forum member, I'm curious to know what mileage it's at now and if it's experienced failure yet.

Are there any service tech forum members that can corroborate or refute the claim that this issue is closer to 40% than 4%? Further, as a GM service employee, are you confident of or skeptical about the reliability of the L87 engine?

I know there's pending legal action relating to this issue, some 42 defendants involved in taking class action against GM, but no verdict has been reached.

I also am aware that some recalls and service bulletins have been produced for specific production dates and models, which is some acknowledgment of a known issue related to production quality.

Just think it would be helpful to try and contextualize all the available information related to the 6.2L lifter/DFM issues to provide better perspective of the scope and risk, and to inform unfortunate owners who may experience it, or prospective buyers before they commit.

 

[MO_ZR2]

Maybe we should start a sticky vote thread on this forum…it’s a small sample size but would be interesting. Assuming Folks can update if they see failure so over time it would be refined…

 

[Ereed45]

Approximately 200k Silverados are rolling around with the L87. You contend that 80k of those have or will have lifter failures?
Approximately 1.2m L87's from model years 2020-2023 are in Tahoes, Suburbans, Yukons, Sierras, and Silverados, based on publicly available sales reports. If you back the 200k that are in Silverado's out of that number, that would be 1m engines, so with 40% failure rate that would be 400k engines that have or will have lifter failures. A majority of which would still be covered under the factory powertrain warranty. Call me crazy, but I think that would be a much more expensive problem for GM, and its ownership base, if the occurrence rate is what you say. I would think NHTSA would force a recall if it was that high, no? I certainly hope I'm not tempting fate by casting doubt on that number, but I think it's hyperbole.

I've owned 3 new Silverado's with the 6.2L (L87); 2020 LT Trail Boss (38k miles), 2022 ZR2 (8.4k miles), 2022 ZR2 (1.5k miles). The first 2022 ZR2 I owned was purchased by another forum member, I'm curious to know what mileage it's at now and if it's experienced failure yet.

Are there any service tech forum members that can corroborate or refute the claim that this issue is closer to 40% than 4%? Further, as a GM service employee, are you confident of or skeptical about the reliability of the L87 engine?

I know there's pending legal action relating to this issue, some 42 defendants involved in taking class action against GM, but no verdict has been reached.

I also am aware that some recalls and service bulletins have been produced for specific production dates and models, which is some acknowledgment of a known issue related to production quality.

Just think it would be helpful to try and contextualize all the available information related to the 6.2L lifter/DFM issues to provide better perspective of the scope and risk, and to inform unfortunate owners who may experience it, or prospective buyers before they commit.

Obviously the 40% was anecdotal based on speaking with 2 different GM mechanics in my town and based on my experience and that of many of my friends. I build hotrods for a living. Currently own 2 Corvettes, a 32 Ford 3 window with a ZZ4 motor, and wife's classic Shelby GT 500, etc. Lifelong Chevy guy. I raced off road trucks years ago. Before I decided to buy the ZR2 I spoke to a local GM service tech who advised me NOT to buy anything with the 6.2 based on his dealership's experience. As due diligence I contacted a second GM employee who basically told me the same thing. I have no idea where you live but here on the east coast these trucks, and as you mentioned Tahoes, Yukons, etc are coming back with failed 6.2's at an alarming rate. So in my opinion, just speaking on the Silverado's, 80K is not an unrealistic number for the entire country. It is still cheaper for GM to repair 80K under warranty rather than recall 200K. I have no info on the rest of the models.

Problem is, they are repairing these 6.2's with the same known defective parts. It appears that if you hire an attorney they will replace the entire motor however according to my local dealer they can't get the 6.2's for 10 or 12 months due to all the replacements. So you pay $75K for a truck that will sit on a dealer lot for 10 months while you make the payments.
My last Silverado 2017 with AFM ate the lifters at less than 10,000 miles. All GM would do is replace one bank and call it a day. I have since been told that a tech bulletin came out recently that allows both banks to be replaced (but again with the defective parts). Now that DFM has 16 defective lifters it greatly increases the chances of failure.

So you ask, why did I go ahead & buy the ZR2 knowing it would fail? I convinced (after paying sticker) my local dealer to extend my powertrain warranty to 200,000 miles and replace the motor when it fails. I just purchased the ZR2 last month and it already has the dreaded death tick and 'service engine' lights.

Second issue. I have gone thru many channels at GM and they all refuse to even discuss the issue. While the local dealerships are well aware, the corporate minions are under a gag order from GM evidently to not discuss. They won't even answer a simple related question. So if there are any real GM mechanics out here that are willing to talk, my question is "if I drive my 6.2 in L9 to keep the DFM from engaging will it extend the life of the motor? Simple question. (I am getting conflicting info from my local guys on this).

I realize the predicament GM is in with the government forcing them to meet mileage guidelines however this DOD garbage is not the answer. GM is screwing all of us over and refusing to admit the truth because it would cost them dearly. I look forward to the current class action lawsuit, but we all know that GM will tie it up in court for years rather than admit wrongdoing.
Do yourself a favor and go to YouTube. There are dozens of postings on this.

 

[scubatech]

Maybe we should start a sticky vote thread on this forum…it’s a small sample size but would be interesting. Assuming Folks can update if they see failure so over time it would be refined…

That is an excellent idea!

 

[scubatech]

Obviously the 40% was anecdotal based on speaking with 2 different GM mechanics in my town and based on my experience and that of many of my friends. I build hotrods for a living. Currently own 2 Corvettes, a 32 Ford 3 window with a ZZ4 motor, and wife's classic Shelby GT 500, etc. Lifelong Chevy guy. I raced off road trucks years ago. Before I decided to buy the ZR2 I spoke to a local GM service tech who advised me NOT to buy anything with the 6.2 based on his dealership's experience. As due diligence I contacted a second GM employee who basically told me the same thing. I have no idea where you live but here on the east coast these trucks, and as you mentioned Tahoes, Yukons, etc are coming back with failed 6.2's at an alarming rate. So in my opinion, just speaking on the Silverado's, 80K is not an unrealistic number for the entire country. It is still cheaper for GM to repair 80K under warranty rather than recall 200K. I have no info on the rest of the models.

Problem is, they are repairing these 6.2's with the same known defective parts. It appears that if you hire an attorney they will replace the entire motor however according to my local dealer they can't get the 6.2's for 10 or 12 months due to all the replacements. So you pay $75K for a truck that will sit on a dealer lot for 10 months while you make the payments.
My last Silverado 2017 with AFM ate the lifters at less than 10,000 miles. All GM would do is replace one bank and call it a day. I have since been told that a tech bulletin came out recently that allows both banks to be replaced (but again with the defective parts). Now that DFM has 16 defective lifters it greatly increases the chances of failure.

So you ask, why did I go ahead & buy the ZR2 knowing it would fail? I convinced (after paying sticker) my local dealer to extend my powertrain warranty to 200,000 miles and replace the motor when it fails. I just purchased the ZR2 last month and it already has the dreaded death tick and 'service engine' lights.

Second issue. I have gone thru many channels at GM and they all refuse to even discuss the issue. While the local dealerships are well aware, the corporate minions are under a gag order from GM evidently to not discuss. They won't even answer a simple related question. So if there are any real GM mechanics out here that are willing to talk, my question is "if I drive my 6.2 in L9 to keep the DFM from engaging will it extend the life of the motor? Simple question. (I am getting conflicting info from my local guys on this).

I realize the predicament GM is in with the government forcing them to meet mileage guidelines however this DOD garbage is not the answer. GM is screwing all of us over and refusing to admit the truth because it would cost them dearly. I look forward to the current class action lawsuit, but we all know that GM will tie it up in court for years rather than admit wrongdoing.
Do yourself a favor and go to YouTube. There are dozens of postings on this.

Man, that sucks on a truck you just bought! I know i'm a bit wary of it. I changed my oil @ 1K & used a light to look for filings, and also the filter looked fine. I told myself if the lifters fail i'll sell it as soon as it's fixed. I like to do a couple road trips a year and I don't need the hassle of calling for a tow. Good information, keep it coming.

 

[DFWZR2]

Obviously the 40% was anecdotal based on speaking with 2 different GM mechanics in my town and based on my experience and that of many of my friends. I build hotrods for a living. Currently own 2 Corvettes, a 32 Ford 3 window with a ZZ4 motor, and wife's classic Shelby GT 500, etc. Lifelong Chevy guy. I raced off road trucks years ago. Before I decided to buy the ZR2 I spoke to a local GM service tech who advised me NOT to buy anything with the 6.2 based on his dealership's experience. As due diligence I contacted a second GM employee who basically told me the same thing. I have no idea where you live but here on the east coast these trucks, and as you mentioned Tahoes, Yukons, etc are coming back with failed 6.2's at an alarming rate. So in my opinion, just speaking on the Silverado's, 80K is not an unrealistic number for the entire country. It is still cheaper for GM to repair 80K under warranty rather than recall 200K. I have no info on the rest of the models.

Problem is, they are repairing these 6.2's with the same known defective parts. It appears that if you hire an attorney they will replace the entire motor however according to my local dealer they can't get the 6.2's for 10 or 12 months due to all the replacements. So you pay $75K for a truck that will sit on a dealer lot for 10 months while you make the payments.
My last Silverado 2017 with AFM ate the lifters at less than 10,000 miles. All GM would do is replace one bank and call it a day. I have since been told that a tech bulletin came out recently that allows both banks to be replaced (but again with the defective parts). Now that DFM has 16 defective lifters it greatly increases the chances of failure.

So you ask, why did I go ahead & buy the ZR2 knowing it would fail? I convinced (after paying sticker) my local dealer to extend my powertrain warranty to 200,000 miles and replace the motor when it fails. I just purchased the ZR2 last month and it already has the dreaded death tick and 'service engine' lights.

Second issue. I have gone thru many channels at GM and they all refuse to even discuss the issue. While the local dealerships are well aware, the corporate minions are under a gag order from GM evidently to not discuss. They won't even answer a simple related question. So if there are any real GM mechanics out here that are willing to talk, my question is "if I drive my 6.2 in L9 to keep the DFM from engaging will it extend the life of the motor? Simple question. (I am getting conflicting info from my local guys on this).

I realize the predicament GM is in with the government forcing them to meet mileage guidelines however this DOD garbage is not the answer. GM is screwing all of us over and refusing to admit the truth because it would cost them dearly. I look forward to the current class action lawsuit, but we all know that GM will tie it up in court for years rather than admit wrongdoing.
Do yourself a favor and go to YouTube. There are dozens of postings on this.

I've read the opposite regarding DFM vs AFM and the failure likelihood. My understanding is that the programmed deactivation scenarios on DFM make it less likely for failure, since the same cylinders are not shutting off every time as they would with AFM.

As you stated, 40% is anecdotal, but you also believe that number based on your own personal experiences and as well as those of owners and mechanics you've spoken with. FWIW, I've watched several explainers on YouTube, and scoured the GM forums for Tahoe, Yukon, and Silverado to get a feel for how common the complaint is. It seems to be even more prevalent on Yukon than on Silverado, but there's a fair amount pointing to the fuel pump as a common failure point.

All of that considered, it's certainly not an insignificant issue, and it seems to happen early in the life of the engine, which makes it all the worse for new owners who spend the most $ as the first buyer.

I'm not convinced however, that the occurrence rate is anywhere near 40%. If it were, the ZR2 forum would be plagued by postings about it, since that is the only engine offering available in our trucks, and this being a flagship trim level and in its first generation, postings here should be more active and timely than some of the other forums. I've seen maybe 5 or 6 confirmed occurrences?

It would be helpful to know from an administrator how many users there are, how many are confirmed owners, and how many are active on a weekly basis, to put the number of reports into perspective to the population of owners.

From my experience here, on the Jeep Wrangler TJ and 392 forums, as well as the Ram TRX forums, enthusiast auto forums are much more active than commuter and kid-hauler forums, but all auto forums share the characteristic of being riddled with postings about mechanical issues and problems. My theory is that the forums are a reasonable sample size to identify common issues, but small and highly concentrated by owner-types, enough to make those issues appear disproportionately more common than they are. YT content creators just piggyback on those trends, or speak from personal experiences.

Starting a new thread to track this issue specifically for the Silverado ZR2. Invite those who have confirmed cases of lifter failures to post there. Evidence in the form of repair invoices and receipts would be helpful too, as well as VIN, so that we can paint a more accurate picture of root cause and identify any commonalities.

 

[scubatech]

I've read the opposite regarding DFM vs AFM and the failure likelihood. My understanding is that the programmed deactivation scenarios on DFM make it less likely for failure, since the same cylinders are not shutting off every time as they would with AFM.

As you stated, 40% is anecdotal, but you also believe that number based on your own personal experiences and as well as those of owners and mechanics you've spoken with. FWIW, I've watched several explainers on YouTube, and scoured the GM forums for Tahoe, Yukon, and Silverado to get a feel for how common the complaint is. It seems to be even more prevalent on Yukon than on Silverado, but there's a fair amount pointing to the fuel pump as a common failure point.

All of that considered, it's certainly not an insignificant issue, and it seems to happen early in the life of the engine, which makes it all the worse for new owners who spend the most $ as the first buyer.

I'm not convinced however, that the occurrence rate is anywhere near 40%. If it were, the ZR2 forum would be plagued by postings about it, since that is the only engine offering available in our trucks, and this being a flagship trim level and in its first generation, postings here should be more active and timely than some of the other forums. I've seen maybe 5 or 6 confirmed occurrences?

It would be helpful to know from an administrator how many users there are, how many are confirmed owners, and how many are active on a weekly basis, to put the number of reports into perspective to the population of owners.

From my experience here, on the Jeep Wrangler TJ and 392 forums, as well as the Ram TRX forums, enthusiast auto forums are much more active than commuter and kid-hauler forums, but all auto forums share the characteristic of being riddled with postings about mechanical issues and problems. My theory is that the forums are a reasonable sample size to identify common issues, but small and highly concentrated by owner-types, enough to make those issues appear disproportionately more common than they are. YT content creators just piggyback on those trends, or speak from personal experiences.

Starting a new thread to track this issue specifically for the Silverado ZR2. Invite those who have confirmed cases of lifter failures to post there. Evidence in the form of repair invoices and receipts would be helpful too, as well as VIN, so that we can paint a more accurate picture of root cause and identify any commonalities.

Great idea! So far all the lifter issues I've seen are 2022 and older. The 2023 is so new that very few people have attained much mileage yet. I've seen a couple posts on here though of someone nearing 10K. I see a lot of GM vehicles in the area that I live in with no issues involving cam / lifter problems.

 

[MO_ZR2]

That is an excellent idea!

6.2 Lifter Failure Poll

For the benefit of forum members and those internet researchers, if you have experienced the dreaded lifter failure please post details after voting (I.e. model year, vin, production date, mileage at failure, etc) You can update your vote IF you unfortunately win this lottery after your initial...

www.chevyzr2.com

There ya go crew

 

[Jetdriver787]

GM is using known defective lifters in their 6.2 motors. It is way more than 4%. I have had 2 now and know friends that ALL have had their motors fail at low miles. YouTube Silverado class action lawsuit. Problem is, yes they will fix under warranty but all they do is replace the same defective lifters and call it a day. I know one guy that threatened to sue and they agree to replace the entire motor but because of the numerous replacements they can't get one for 10 months. So you end up making payments on a truck sitting at a dealership waiting on a motor they can't get. Shame on GM.

Had a 2018 GMC Sierra 1500, SCA Black Widow truck with the 6.2L engine. Just traded it in for a 2022 ZR2 that was 7K off MSRP. I had ZERO issues with the 6.2L in five years and 75,000 miles.

 

[ZR2NYC]

Of course he said that...he's a salesman and wants to desperately sell you a truck

great point

 

[R I G]

Since I haven’t owned a chevrolet since 2001, I joined this forum and read a bunch of threads about lifter issues so naturally I grilled my salesman before buying my 23 ZR2, he said they were the leading ZR2 dealer in Texas and haven’t had any lifter issues with any trucks, cross my fingers

Ask him to say it again, but....
...he's not allowed to crack a smile.... Not even grin....

If he makes it that far, then without missing a beat, ask him to say, "you can trust me" after too.

If he passes that test, ask him if he'd let his grandmother drive it to church... then say,
"aw hell, you haven't had any issues with any of them, so if mine's the one you'll just buy it back anyway!" (loudly...and look around the dealership, nervously...)

and then ask him to put that last part in writing. JUST to be safe.

You're golden.

RiG